I got this great "guest rant" from a pattern seller (who will remain anonymous) and I thought it was worth posting.
[Although] I will note that no one's raised the issue of "How much did they pay people for the valuable vintage they are offering us" or "I bet they paid $5.00 for 20 patterns, how can they charge us $15.00 each for them??" (or significantly more, in some cases).
[It's] a very valid point and I don't want to ruin your comment section by addressing it … I have a good answer for how and why I price my offerings:
Yes I often buy boxes of old patterns for very little cost for the box. But I got up at 4:00AM to be first in line at the estate sale that I thought might possibly have vintage patterns. I stood in line for 2 hours and tried to be first in the door. When I got in the door I started pushing past people and heading for the garage or shed where the patterns usually are and lo and behold there are 2 boxes, rat pellets, roach carcasses and all …
I make my best deal and tote the smelly mess to my car. When I get them home I sit down and go through them to see if there are any beautiful finds that need my immediate attention. I sort by priority which goes first and which gets stored for another day. Then I start with the high priority ones and spread out and check to make sure all the pieces are there and cry when they aren't. I remove old pins (usually unless I miss one), I iron the envelope and the instructions so they are nice and readable.
Then I scan (or rather the DH scans) the envelope and sends it to me. I size it and clarify it a bit so it is readable. If I'm feeling creative I "clean" the front just for my files and cause I like 'em that way. Then it's time to write the listing. Gotta hold that pattern so I know the proper size and measurements … 'cause they're mostly different through the years.
Then I package the little beauty in a plastic bag and file it away until it goes to its new owner … by this time I've spent an average of 1-2 manhours, gasoline (at $4 a gallon) and we don't even count the time spent in line at the estate sale …
Now it's listing time … we all know that eBay doesn't do anything for free (and even website space costs) so I've got 1-2 hours time, a plastic bag, gas money, and then we add FEES. Take away everything else and the fees alone eat into the profit. If I manage to get $9.99 for a pattern and it better be a special one … I get to put $8.00 of that in my pocket. Take away a few cents for packaging and equipment (scanner, computer, iron) maintenance and we're down to $7.50 … O yeah, the 25 cents I paid for the pattern … we're at $7.25. IF THE PATTERN SELLS! Considering the 1-2 manhours involved … That's below minimum wage.
I thought this was worth posting because so many of us forget about the overhead and just plain TIME that's involved in running a small business, especially when you're doing everything yourself (or with the help of your spouse, who may or may not have another full-time job). Sure, I hear people say "I could buy that at the Salvation Army for a dollar," but I always want to ask them "Really? That exact pattern? You're sure it's there? When do they close, by the way?"
You're really paying for everything above, plus the luxury of choice — being able to select from the range of patterns in the seller's web store. And (at least for my advertisers) reassurance that all the pieces are there, and a good chance of a refund if they're not (try that with the Salvation Army …).
One last thing: if you do think vintage patterns are too expensive, you have a lot of options. You can not buy them, for one. Modern patterns are much, much cheaper (if you wait for the $1.99 pattern sales at the major fabric chains). You can set up a wait-for-it search on eBay and hope someone who doesn't know what they have will list it. And, of course, you can always draft your own.
That pattern up above? It's $75 (at The Blue Gardenia, sorry, there's not direct link to the pattern page). Unused, an in-demand bust size, a fancy pattern, and a great illustration. Is it worth $75? It is to somebody!
A Dress A Day 
That’s a great rant and I agree with every word she says.Personally, I’m surpised vintage patterns don’t usually cost more than they do!
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Supply and demand set the market, and I appreciate having the work laid out for me. Friend with an art gallery constantly hears “oh, I could do that. Arg.
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Where did this discussion start? I’m feeling like I’ve missed something.Plain and simple, the price of patterns is based on supply and demand. How early a vendor gets up in the morning doesn’t really concern me. We all have some drudgery associated with our jobs, no matter what they are. You are selling something that 99.9 percent of the population would toss into the rubbish bin without a second thought. We KNOW you didn’t pay much if anything for it, and that’s okay. But please, let’s not make excuses for the outrageous prices of some patterns.I appreciate the effort that goes into counting vintage pattern pieces, but I ain’t paying $75 for a pattern unless Coco Chanel personally drafted it!
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My first reaction to seeing that pattern was that I would pay $100 if that was in my wife’s size. It is a stunning illustration.People who complain in a manner similar to that described are simply reacting without thinking. Once you explain it to them, they tend to understand. It is just easier to rant.Posting information like this really helps educate.Semper Fi,Terry
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I think ebay is quite reasonable…I’ve gotten patterns for as little as $4 including shipping. And I’ve tried checking out estate sales to no avail…either machines but no patterns or patterns in the wrong decade (I prefer 50s or 60s). So I think that the prices aren’t that bad considering I like the design (today’s stuff just isn’t as attractive IMHO) and the fit is better for me. Would I pay $145 for the pattern I saw online that I loooooove…not unless it’s a birthday present to myself. Considering the cost of the pattern, fabric, notions and what-not I think I come out ahead anyways.
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While I do understand the point of the rant, I think it’s ludicrous to say that that pattern above is worth $75. Usually, patterns highlighted on your site sell immediately. I notice that one’s still there. Apparently I’m not the only one who doesn’t think it’s worth that much–no matter what time the seller got up to go to the sale.
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It’s true, the price of anything is a function of supply and demand.The supply of vintage patterns is pretty small, and it’s pretty hard to find except through a certain supply stream.The demand isn’t very *broad*, but within its niche, it can be high.If someone can charge $75 for a pattern, and someone will actually pay it, then that is the true value of that pattern.It’s not morally wrong somehow.It might be morally wrong for a drug that saves people’s lives to cost an exhorbitant amount, but not an optional item like a vintage pattern.And likewise, someone who puts in all the effort described isn’t morally entitled to a higher price, nor do they deserve it. They’ll likely GET that higher price, because someone wants the pattern they’ve salvaged and prepared and made available through that aforementioned supply stream.I would imagine that if the folks at The Blue Gardenia find that no one wants to buy that pattern you showed, they’ll drop the price. Until it sells.
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There’s a lot of this going around. People expect themselves to be paid well but balk at paying anyone else well. (insert your own Walmart rant here) And as you say, it’s up to that “someone” to decide the item is worth the price. There’s a pattern I’ve had my eye on for a while but am not sure it’s worth the $45 the seller is asking. So far, I guess, the answer is ‘no’ but it’s a very cool dress, with exactly the skirt I want on it. As you also say, you could learn to draft it yourself. It’s either time or money – spend your time or spend your money to pay other people to spend theirs. And Erin, that is a beautiful pattern you’ve used to illustrate the point. I’d make it without the flower and wear an impressive necklace. Then I’d go dancing and give that skirt plenty of chances to twirl around me! Thanks for the discussion.Dawn
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I never wondered this at all. I wondered how anyone could make a living selling them for less than $15 or so! Heck I even chalked up the $85 patterns to being rare/unique and desirable/collectible…supply and demand.The answer left out Pay Pal fees. Once you sell something through PP, you gotta cut them in for their share too. And let us not forget that contemporary pattern go for…how much? $15 – $25 for Vogue patterns unless you are like me and refuse to buy them until Hancock or Joann have the $3.99 sales.Vintage patterns have a certain provenance that make them worth paying more for, imho.
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I’m willing to pay more just to have someone else deal with the dead cockroaches. Eeeeewwwwww!!!!1!Hee.
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I dont sell a lot of patterns, its not my forte, but this is an interesting post to me as a vintage clothing seller with a website and a real-world store. I have often, in one day, had a customer balk at a dress priced at or above $100 and then a customer who is in town from NYC or the west coast (Im in Iowa) shop like crazy and exclaim as they check out that they love the shop, selection and would pay double back where they live. Im lucky to have an established site and have sold long enough to know what the market will bear so I can price accordingly. I naturally hestitated to ask those prices here in Des Moines….but a year and half after opening, I have found most customers here just as savvy and understanding of the value of vintage as big city buyers. Its still insulting to have people come in and expect thrift store prices and assume I buy from thrifts! I rarely, if ever, get time to shop and the thrifts rarely yield the type of merchandise I offer, in the condition I offer it. I work with estate dealers, private sellers and auction houses. I have a pile of handwashing, mending and stain removal projects taller than me in my dining room! I consign some things so often my price is for 2 people to make a profit. The time I spend…mending, washing, removing stains, researching labels, comparable items online and the prices they sell for, sewing/design techniques, textiles used, dating….add to that the time taking pictures, editing pictures, painstakingly measuring and describing garments as well as the financial upkeep of my shop AND website all factor in to my prices. It makes me crazy to be told someone can buy the same thing themselves at Goodwill (or whatever). I work about 70 hours a week at least to maintain my business. All said and done, Im hardly a jabillionaire. Im a single Mom who gets no child support and I have to maintain a nice apartment, bills, car payment, debts, food/gas/daycare, rent at my shop, utilities there, advertising and a fairly constant influx of expense for stock to keep the shop site current and interesting to repeat visitors. Vintage clothing and patterns are perhaps not necessarily scarce, but not all that easy to find in good enough condition to offer with no work involved to restore or make presentable. And again, the marker is determined by the buyers. If the market wont bear the asked price, the price perhaps will drop. Or go up. Or the item the customer wanted will be sold and gone forever….which happens more often than not in my experience!Thanks for posting this, Erin, sorry to be so wordy!Ang
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For anyone to get indignant about the cost of something so unessential to life as a vintage pattern is ludicrous. Yes, we love them. Yes, we want them. And if someone is willing to pay $75 for anything then I guess it’s worth $75. Personally, I delight at seeing a pattern as exquisite as this, even if I don’t choose to own it. Phantom Ranter I wish for you that from now on you can simply roll your eyes at these complaints.
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When I find myself going ballistic over the price of a vintage pattern, I usually end up laughing. Why? Because I recognize that I’m reacting at the emotional level of a 2-year-old who wants something, now, on his or her own terms. There’s a sense of consumer entitlement at issue here that I find more disturbing than high prices for non-essential goods.
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I’ll agree, it’s what the market will bear, but can you put a price on a memory? I just found a pattern the other day, for a 70yo woman. She wore it to prom in 1955, but couldn’t remember the number, the maker….none of it. I got her email (with photo) in January. Found the pattern for her the day before yesterday — not in my store, but on ebay — and her granddaughters are elated. They can now wear grandma’s prom dress to their own prom.Can you put a price on that kind of thing? That’s why I love patterns. They are a piece of history, that without people to preserve them, would literally fall apart in front of us, and be lost forever.And just for the record, I *love* treasure hunts like the aforementioned one. I didn’t make a penny on it, but it’s great to help someone find their dream pattern.Just try to put a price on that.And for the record, I’m not a morning person, so 4am at an estate sale deserves something, in my book. That’s usually about when I go to bed. LOL
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Anon at 7:18, The fact that 99.9% of the population would throw them in the trash is why most vintage patterns sell for $10-$30 instead of $100-$300. Even at $75, you’re only paying 3 or 4 times the full retail price of a new pattern. The “rant” from the dealer doesn’t even mention that most of the time, after waiting in line at that estate sale for 2 hours, there are no patterns to be found. I once went out of my way to an estate sale in a swanky, old-money neighborhood that advertised a sewing machine among the items available. There’s got to be patterns there, right? No, not a single pattern. No fabric, either, for some reason.When I was younger, I would hit the local flea market bright and early every weekend. Most of the time, there wasn’t a single pattern to be found, although I’d usually pick up other items. Can you imagine how many hours you would have to spend scouring estate sales and flea markets to turn up something like this stunning 50s special occasion dress pattern in pristine condition? In your size? Now that I’m a mom, I can’t hit the flea market every weekend, so I’ll gladly pay someone else to do the legwork of finding these gems and bringing them to light.
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Very interesting background on how one seller finds their patterns, especially the vintage one.. I don’t have that luxury of estate sales, but somehow find those lovely vintage 50s ball gown patterns and earlier… One concern I have is the mention of rodents and that has been in the back of my mind for a long time. We don’t know where a lot of these patterns have been,, there is a hantevirus scare to do with mouse droppings.. If I suspect a mouse has been to the pattern first, I throw it out. Has anyone that sells out there encountered this and what is their solution? Can a pattern be sanitized!!!! and thanks again for the insight.. My most unusual antique pattern find was in an antique shop, and they had an old Laura Secord chocolate box in the corner and three patterns inside dated 1920s and 1930s… great find!!!
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Anon @ 7:18 p.m.:How early a vendor gets up in the morning doesn’t really concern me. We all have some drudgery associated with our jobs, no matter what they are.Yes, all jobs have drudgery, even selling patterns. It is her job, and she deserves to be compensated for her time, whether it’s at 4 a.m. or 4 p.m.
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sigh. There is something fundamentally wrong in our society when we don’t think it is worth paying a reasonable fee for someone’s time and EXPERTISE. The cost of most goods comes from the time they take to make / source / prepare rather than the raw materials. Its the same with my work:http://mantua-maker.blogspot.com/2007/02/pricing-your-work.htmlThe finest vintage patterns are collector’s pieces. Its well understood in other fields (like high-quality vintage classical LPs which my mum sells) that rarity value and quality up the price. Look at fine art! How much does that cost to produce, in terms of the raw materials?? Our society still consistently undervalues women’s work and the low perceived value of sewn work and associated ephemera like patterns is all part of that. We need to work towards changing it, not continuing it.
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I’m fine with those sorts of prices on a number of levels (and goodness the example above isnt’ even the most expensive on that site!). Firstly the price reflects supply and demand, simple as that. If someone will pay the asking price for it then it’s worth it. Secondly, as many people have mentioned, people deserve to be paid a fair price for their time, labour and your convenience. Not everything is made in a sweatshop in China and therefore sold for pennies. And how much is the convenience of sitting on your butt in front of a computer screen scrolling through lovely, preselected patterns worth to you? If you get paid $25/hr at your job and you spend 3 hours searching dusty bins in op-shops to find one pattern, then by my reckoning that pretty ordinary pattern cost you $75. And lastly, I’m blown away that you can actually get an original pattern designed by Balenciaga at all – it’s a piece of social history, possibly unique, and it’s sitting there online ready to buy. Cheap at twice the price really. Obviously not all patterns are so unique, or beautiful like the one above, but some are and boy they deserve the respect that big price-tags command imho!
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Great “rant”. It helped me to get a better perspective. As to whether I pay a certain price depends on my budget, my “want” factor and whether it is my treasure or someone elses junk. It does get down to my choice, to buy or not to buy. Thanks for posting this.
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In the knitting world, some consider yarn to be expensive only if it’s never used and the completed project never worn. Is that true with vintage patterns? If so, I’ve got lots of pricey old patterns.
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One thing about patterns and cost is that you can use your pattern again and again. So if you pay say $12.00 for a pattern (patterns in my store are $12.00 or less) and make that dress say 6 times you’re looking at $2.00 for the pattern use and whatever you spend for your notions and fabrics.Comparatively speaking, using a vintage pattern allows you to have as many custom tailored outfits as you want for a very reasonable price.
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Let’s put this in perspective. The original comment was probably made with respect to patterns now selling for significantly more than the $10 to $15 range that most patterns go for.I’ve seen Vogue Paris Originals/Couturier patterns double in price over the last year, and I think that part, but only part, of the reason is because people have become aware of the detail involved in these vintage patterns. So the increase in price is indeed fueled by supply and demand.However, there is an interesting phenomenon developing in the trade of these patterns, which is driving up the supply price (kind of a Reagonomics supply drives demand phenomenon). When I go onto eBay and try to buy a pattern and get outbid by a sniper with 1000s of purchses to his/her name, and then I see it show up for multiples of what was paid, I personally get pissed off and won’t buy from that person again. Yes, my decision. But I actually want to make something from that pattern and now it has moved out of my price range. (And it languishes on that site.)This fuels more similar action. Now I can’t afford the patterns that I was able to buy a year ago. Where will this lead? I hope that Vogue and Butterick wake up and really start digging into their archives, reproducing more of their couturier patterns. Make them available to many, many people who like to sew. If the copyrights have expired, more and more people will copy them and offer them for resale at a much more reasonable price. More power to them. I’ve bought quite a few of those.Frankly, I think some have gotten too greedy. I see a lot of patterns are staying on websites, prices not reduced. Not a surprise. With the economy heading south, it will be interesting to see what happens. Probably more overseas designers will buy them up (this is who can afford the extremely high prices because it is a business expense and they need the design ideas — I had this from a seller of these types of patterns), which means they go away. So I tried to build my “library” while I could, and I’m sad that so many beautiful patterns have moved out of my reach. Does that give me the emotional maturity of a 2 year old? Perhaps I would feel less disgruntled if the actual creator of the designs were getting a chunk of the exhorbitant prices being charged for some of these patterns.I buy from a number of sellers, and I don’t mean you. I mean those who I have stopped buying from. And I have a number of sewing buddies who feel and act the same way. Just to put this in perspective.Regards,Elle
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Interesting post! Ive never really broken it down to a per hour sort of thing, selling patterns.. but I KNOW the amount of time involved in selling them. I feel like Ive ALWAYS got a box full in front of me in some stage of being listed. Ive got the Pieces Need To Be Counted Bins, the Counted, Needs to be Scanned Bins, the Scanned, Needs to be Typed (from the back) and the DONE, Needs to be Listed Bins.My own pricing is based on supply, demand, size condition. Do I have an 80s Butterick A-Line Skirt, Waist 23 pattern with a ripped up envelope? Eh, I might not even list it. Do I have a 50s Vogue Patou Evening Gown, complete, size 16? Do I wanna bite my nails all week hopeful for a bidding war, or just sell it directly in my store for $75?As Im personally trying to leave ebay fees far behind, Im putting more and more of my cherry finds into my store, and trying to establish fair prices. A price where I can be competitive with auction pricing while not creating a frenzy of bids; a price that at the end of the day, Im happy with, and my buyer is happy with!Like Ang, I feel Ive also been doing what I do long enough to know what my good stuff is, and what to price it at fairly. And hey! Most web sites or online sellers offer coupons or discounts for being on a mailing list.. or as a promotion with a previous purchase.. or with multiple buys.. or we broadcast it here with Erin! I know I do! So when you find that hefty priced pattern you MUST have.. no harm in checking around for % off discounts, and never hurts ASKING to barter :)So youve taken YOUR time to read my pre-coffee mumblings jumblings? Visit my store and use coupon code fireworks15 and youll save 15% off your order at my store. See.. that was EASY! lolPeace to the Pattern People! Everyone enjoy your weekend!
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There is something fundamentally wrong in our society when we don’t think it is worth paying a reasonable fee for someone’s time and EXPERTISE. Exactly! And add to that, editing skills. I buy for resale, maybe 1% of the vintage patterns I encounter. I feel that my “eye” is an important part of my site, and it sure feels good when a customer emails and says they appreciate the carefully edited offerings.The majority of the patterns on my site are $15. That is the “make or break” point; any less and I’d not be making any kind of a profit. And then what would be the point? I’d have no reason to continue selling.I believe that when you spend your money, that’s when your opinion matters most! There are plenty of people who are willing to spend $15 for a great vintage pattern. For those who are not, they must spend the time and do the leg work (or seat work, if they shop eBay!) to get their $1 “bargain.”
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Gotta confess that the prices of some vintage patterns just make me think it’s time to learn to draft my own. Today’s pattern is lovely but it’s not so complex that it couldn’t be draped herself by somebody who knew a little about what they were doing. Might not be made *exactly* the same way, but you could get darned close (close enough).While I am all for people doing jobs that they love, and people are certainly free to charge what they want for things, I also think it’s true that some jobs are not a living. (I’m not saying pattern selling isn’t or shouldn’t be a living, mind you.) I paint, and I certainly love it enough that I feel it should be my job, but the truth is that it is not necessary enough, to enough people, for it to be my primary occupation. If I were to persist in trying to make it so despite numerous clues that that is not a practical ambition, I can hardly blame the rest of the world.* * * * * * *I wonder sometimes if the “old book” mindset doesn’t sometimes come into play. People tend to think that, just because something is old, it’s valuable. I see this all the time at work: People think that just because their books are old, they’re valuable. The truth is that the vast majority of old books are not valuable (even if they are relatively rare). They’re just used books. Disappointing, but true.
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Let’s put this in perspective. The original comment was probably made with respect to patterns now selling for significantly more than the $10 to $15 range that most patterns go for.Possibly, but I have read comments on this blog to the effect that $15 is too much for a patern. I remember it so well because Erin used one of my patterns as an illustration, and one of the first comments was a complaint that the pattern cost too much – $15.
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Erin, that’s why I sent YOU all my old patterns. It’s too much WORK to sell them :)I’m amazed that people will spend $6 for a cup of (burnt tasting) coffee and won’t invest $8 in the perfect pattern!Carol
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I have always believed that if something is priced too high for me then buying it is out of the question. Everyone has this option, because let’s face it, who really needs a pattern? It is a luxury.I too operate a small business and I can tell you that my overhead is large, my time investment is large too. I make sure I am compensated for it, if I weren’t I wouldn’t do it. But I don’t go down the list with everyone to make sure they appreciate how much I do. Nobody gripes to me about my fees because I do a good job and deliver a valuable service. So, either buy the pattern or don’t. The seller just puts it out there and that is literally their business. If it does not sell they will most likely lower the price.
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I must admit I wouldnt dream of putting 75 on a pattern like this one but yeah for capitalism if it sells Ill be rethinking my pricing structure for sure. 🙂 I would add though whether youre a collector or reseller of vintage anything – if you run into cockroach carcasses rat droppings at a sale its probably not worth whatever is waiting to be bought – you might cart home something else besides a new treasure!
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Wow, this is a great post and great responses. I don’t think buyers take the time to consider all of the time and work that goes into selling patterns and vintage clothing (add cleaning and measuring to the preparation time for getting clothing ready to sell) Plus, you may have to go to 10 sales before you find some patterns or clothing to buy. Not every thrift is full of fabulous and cheap vintage stuff. Not all sellers are paying thrift shop prices for their stock. I haven’t bought stock from a thrift shop in about 5-6 years. If I depended on a thrift shop to provide me cheap stock, I would have gone out of business years ago.Vintage-anything can’t be found in your size, in great condition at your price on every corner. People will pay over $100 for a pair of new shoes. How much do you think it really cost to make those shoes? But someone will buy them because they are super cute, well, made, maybe a good name maker. If you really love something, you decide how much you are willing to pay for it. If you don’t like the price, go find something in your price range – don’t insult or think badly of the seller.
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As a designer and seamstress myself, I will never. EVER. EVER! bargain with someone else over the value of what she is selling, whether it’s artwork, or jewelry, or vintage patterns. If I have the money for it, I pay it and say “Thank you!” and move on. If I don’t have the money, I admire it wistfully, smile, and move on. I won’t bargain down what the maker/owner thinks something is worth; this isn’t a flea market (I WILL bargain at a flea market, it’s part of the ambiance, and expected). Either I can afford it, or I can’t.Canine Diamond, I think we must be looking at different books. I have found that some of the books I’ve bought have more than tripled in value, and they weren’t cheap when I bought them. Unfortunately for me, there are plenty of books I’ve meant to get, and then when I try to find them, even though they’re only a couple of years old, they’ve completely gone out of my Book-Buying Range.As far as vintage patterns go, if it’s something unusual, or part of a particular silhouette that I collect, I will pay more for it (if I have the money). If I don’t have the money, well, I have a ruler and a pencil; I don’t expect the seller to drop her price just because I wish the patterns were cheaper! (It doesn’t work with gas, I tried that first; so why would it work for patterns?)
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A pattern drafted by Chanel herself would be selling for way more than $75!
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I have purchased patterns for $30.00 or even $45.00 dollars. I buy from sellers and at prices I think are fair. I have not yet purchased anything from the featured seller because the prices are relatively high compared with other sellers in the market. As a second issue, I am sure that many/most resellers do get up early to be the first in line at an estate sale. On the other hand, in the metropolitan area where I live, resellers often get preferential treatment, including being able to “shop” an estate sale the day before the genral public or for several hours before the general public is allowed into the estate sale. This is a decided advantage in the market. Just saying. It’s the other side of the coin.Amy
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I’m sorry to say that the big 4 patterns companies do NOT have an archive. They only keep what is in stock at present and recently discontinued. Perhaps some of you might remember when Vogue began their Vintage Vogue line, they requested people to send them patterns. They do not have a secret stash of all the patterns they created. They, like many of the other people re-printing vintage patterns, have to work with patterns that people saved. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve heard – “Oh my mom sewed! I threw her patterns out when she died.” I’d hate to think about what will happen to my stash when I’m 6 feet under. 🙂
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I didn’t write the rant, but I could have. I sell patterns now, but sold antiques for years and the story was the same. These are jobs that are really labors of love, because you won’t ever get paid for your time. Finding the right pattern and matching it up to the right person takes a tiny miracle…and it has to be the right size! I think of vintage patterns as pieces of history, treasured things to be honored. Use them, wear them, but don’t forget the journey they took to get to you. Tina
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As a pattern buyer, sometimes I see something I really like priced WAY above my budget… but then I think, would I pay that much if I wanted to use this as my wedding dress? I can usually answer yes, so I just close my eyes and imagine how happy the pattern will make the person who can justify its purchase.
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Any item is only worth what someone will pay for it. If someone wants it – they will pay the price for it – and they should not complain. I don’t pay listed price for any of the new patterns. I always wait until they are on sale at the fabric stores for $.99 or $1.99. But, I am lucky on vintage patterns == all the ladies in my family were great at sewing their own frocks in the ’40’s and beyond, and I am the respository of those patterns. I can’t use the sizes myself, but they have family history involved in them. I do buy patterns on Ebay and at other venues – some just for decoration/inspiration, but I only pay what I want to pay – it’s not a “do or die” situation at any time. Put limits on what you are willing to pay, and let it go at that!
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What a beautiful, beautiful dress. I wish I’d found that pattern in April when I was looking for a dress for my daughter’s wedding. I tried on everything reasonably non-ugly in 3 counties for up to $400.00 and couldn’t find anything I was happy with. I bought a pattern and remnant cloth and made a suitably pretty dress, but at that time I would have paid $75.00 for this pattern. Love it! But don’t need it now!
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Interesting discussion. As a vintage clothing reseller, this “thrift store” mindset does come up periodically.Look– I do this FOR A LIVING and do you know how much vintage I have THAT FITS ME in my own closet? Not much. Why? Because I can search for hours and hours and days and days and if I’m LUCKY I might find ONE item that I like and that fits me.Most of my own vintage I bought at retail prices from other sellers.Also — every now and then I’ll have a customer exclaim something like “$40!! I could by that at Goodwill for $5!”I say then go do it! I’ll bet you leave empty handed after way more than $40 worth of your time.But what’s really funny is that whenever an item illicits that response, invariably someone else comes along shortly and pays the $40 without blinking.It’s all perspective. Just because it’s not worth $40 TO YOU doesn’t mean it’s not worth $40.AND– I don’t get this attitude that it’s somehow “greedy” for a seller to purchase something at the asking price and attempt to sell it for more? That’s just plain silly. That’s what our whole economy is based on! Every last bit of it!Is it greedy for you to go to work and expect to be paid? I get the feeling that there are people out there that RESENT the fact that those of us who do this professionally actually do make a living. They seem to think we only have a right to do it as a hobby and therefor charge a pittance for our time and goods.No offense, but unless you’re willing to cut your pay in half, please don’t suggest that I cut mine.
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I agree with ruth singer that there is still an almost universal down-valuing of things related to tasks and interests that are traditionally women’s. There is also a tendency to look at the final product as an absolute: Is it a vintage pattern reflecting the knowledge and skills of the drafter, reflecting the social history of the time, and miraculously preserved? No, it’s a bunch of old tissue paper in an envelope. Is it a fabulous dress that perfectly reflects the wearer’s personality, a dress in which she both looks beautiful and feels at ease– a dress which took creative thought and planning and skill and effort to bring to fruition? No, it’s… jeez, it’s a *dress* already… you could’ve gotten a dress at the store and saved yourself the trouble… what’s the big deal? People often overlook the intangible things that give an item its value.
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There are the haves and the have-nots; its nice to be able to afford it, but that $75.00 is more than likely too steep for those of us who learned to sew from our youth not only for personal choice fit, but to save money. Ergo; although I do sympathize with what the seller(s) must put into the patterns in order to make any kind of a profit at all, it still will belong to those who have great jobs or a wealthy dead Uncle. For the rest of us – we as well need to look for a deal to make ends meet. It all makes drafting a pattern look more and more attractive, doesnt it?Best of luck to both sides. God Bless.
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What a great post! As the owner of 10,000 vintage sewing patterns, I can totally relate to what she is saying. I too would haunt those estate sales, and labor with love through counting, prepping, and ironing those pieces. Finally it got the best of me, and my lonely patterns sit, waiting for the day I will renew my enthusiasm for them. I can appreciate every word that she has typed. You deserve every hard earned penny.Bradie
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I don’t resent those who put in their labor to improve the product (picking through envelopes, matching pieces, etc).I do resent those who get up at 3 am to snatch up the patterns/clothing so they can, without adding substantial value, make the end-users pay more for them. They’re not creating anything. They’re basically parasitic.Are they entitled to make a certain wage? Am I entitled to cheap patterns? No, and no. Do they have a right to make a living this way? Sure, whatever, free country. Do I have a right to be annoyed by it? Yes. I simply have a preference for professions that either create something or add value. Too often resellers do neither, enriching themselves at the overall detriment of the market.
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As with any shopping spree . . . if you LOVE IT and WANT IT you will pay the price. I don’t care if it’s a bottle of wine, a great pair of shoes, a new car or a sewing pattern. Obviously the person selling patterns makes some determination of the value based on their own taste as well as market demand. I know as an antique dealer and seller of vintage patterns, I am constantly saying, “If I can get $200 for my Roseville vase, I will sell it. Otherwise I will keep it and cherish it!”
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Resellers are parasitic for saving these items (often from the the trash bin or raghouses or even worse fates) because you can’t get them at rock bottom prices or for free?Sounds like nothing but sour grapes to me.And considering that NOT everyone has the time or inclination to get up at 3am to source these goods, those who do so DO, in fact, add substantial value to these items for the people that they buy for. I know that not a darn one of my clients is going to drag themselves through MY day to purchase something (that will probably not fit them anyway) just to save a few dollars – instead, they’re grateful that someone else is doing all that and bringing it to them. THAT is supply and demand. So it’s not for you? Fine – but that doesn’t make it parasitic or wrong. I find more value in what *I* do than all those millions out there pushing papers and selling insurance under fluorescent lighting.What, pray tell, do YOU do for a living that you so enrich the world?Is a copy editor simply living off the back of the author/writer, bringing up the overall costs of books and “enriching themselves at the overall detriment of the market”? What about the producer? what about the distribution house? Etc etc.EVERY industry is somehow linked to another and sustains itself by connection. To deny that is foolish and ignorant. Would that I could buy all my food, paper goods and laundry soap AT THE SOURCE at much cheaper prices. I should rail at Target and the local grocery for bringing all these things to me under one roof for a higher price! (of course, with the cost of gas, my prices after driving around to purchase items at the source would likely be higher than at the local store!)
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This discussion prompted me to pony up the $18 for a vintage pattern I’ve long been wanting! Great perspective on the work that goes into the business.I think I tend to get spoiled by the $1.99 / $3.99 pattern sales at JoAnne’s. Good reminder that the modern patterns just don’t have the finesse that the vintage ones do.
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I totally agree with the ‘rant’. I have a perfect understanding that a seller might not be profiteering off of me, but their overhead is such where there is going to be a difference between point A and point B.I have zero problem with someone making a profit. I try to find bargains myself, but I don’t have the leads/opportunities/options that a professional pattern picker-througher might have.I am not one to complain about prices. If I truly want the pattern, I pay the price and clutch the pattern to me like a long-lost Leonardo.Thanks Erin, for bringing forward an oft-neglected truth, and shining some light on yet another facet that most people don’t consider!
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What an interesting topic. Most of the vintage patterns I see seem quite affordable. As for the really pricey ones; they’re like museum pieces, in that they are rare. Yes, you might find that in your grandmother’s attic, but how many grandmothers do you have, and how many attics did SHE have, and did she even sew in the first place? You might be able to search out the same pattern for less (some day, some way) but the time that would take and the travel involved would, practically speaking, make that newfound cheaper pattern more expensive than the original one you fell in love with. It’s the old “Penny Wise, Pound Foolish” thing. Basically, if every vintage pattern were $75 we’d all be in deep, deep trouble. But they’re not. (PS: I am feeling that demon Image Wunderlust again! Please excuse my changing appearance!)
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PS: I’m shocked pattern companies don’t keep archives. It’s not like tissue paper patterns take up THAT much space, do they? This 1966 pattern on the right was just featured on the Burda site as part of a retrospective slide show, and they can’t even tell me what the original pattern number WAS! To a bookworm like me, there’s something rather SCARY about that! (I’ll load the image at the vintage pattern wiki site as Burda 0002, in case anyone ever learns more info and can update it.)
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